The New York Times, a renowned news source all over the world, is asking for submissions. The question they have posed is a difficult one. One that I have never considered. One that I feel I have the answer to, but have no way of communicating my feelings logically. "
Why is it ethical to eat meat?" It's a doozy of a question, that's for sure. The arguments against eating meat based on ethics are incredibly strong, and, I must admit, make certain amounts of logical sense. But there must be some reason why we eat meat. Something way down tells us that the activity is OK, and I have never questioned my moral integrity after tucking in to a beautiful New York or Tenderloin. Why? I don't know. It isn't taste, which does keep me coming back, it isn't the need for meat, though I do have cravings here in University. Why don't we feel the same remorse for the animals we consume as we feel for the people we may kill in wars? It is definitely a troubling question, very troubling and difficult to answer. If you think you have it, I encourage you to submit it to The Times for evaluation. I know I will if I have my epiphany by the deadline. It appears that the Pro-Meat arguments are only just beginning, after at least three decades of pro-vegetarian hounding. So, I ask you all to please comment with your thoughts, and visit the link to read the article from The Times.
Tell Us Why It's Ethical To Eat Meat
Posts
Thanks for posting a video that exemplifies and perfects the lies vegetarians are told everyday by organizations like PETA. I will not dispute the fact that these are actual videos of horrible, terrible circumstances. However, they are circumstances that are concentrated into 13 minutes, and under no circumstances do they represent anything remotely true about the animal industry. The people in these videos are generally bad people, doing horrible things to animals that deserve every ounce of respect we can offer them.
ReplyDeleteCattle do NOT live their lives being fed unnatural diets that cause them bloat and constant pain. Allow me to prove this to you: When people are sick, or injured, and do not receive medical aid, they tend to lose weight, mass, their hair gets brittle and dry, their bones become fragile, their eyes weak, their internal systems begin to shut down, and eventually the person will die. Take the comparison between Africa and North America as an example of what healthy people and unhealthy people look like, if you need to.
You've got me going. Here is the rest of the reply:
ReplyDeleteNow that we have the images in our heads of malnutritioned people, apply those same images to cattle. Are they thin? No. People don't eat thin cattle. Are their bones brittle? No, cattle with weak bones are not transportable, and have historically been genetically selected against. Are their eyes constantly watery and infected? No! Cattle that cannot see cannot be used in the food chain, due to the risk of contamination. They are euthanized on site, and very, very rarely by anything other than a veterinarian. Are these animals systems shutting down? Nope again. To maintain positive growth curves, cattle need to have fully functioning, completely healthy digestive, respiratory, and nervous systems. Otherwise, they too begin to look like the mental image of the third world human being. I hope it is obvious to you that so very few of the cattle you pass in the pastures alongside the highways are ill or incapacitated. These same rules apply to all animals. Animals simply will not produce the muscle that we slaughter them for without proper nutrition and health management, environmental management, and behavioral management.
Being no expert on chickens, I have certain distaste for the use of battery cages and crowding of the market pullets. However, being a livestock produce, I also see the economics of using such facilities to cut back on personnel, and overall cost. Instead of refusing poultry altogether, find a small, local producer who is willing to feed and house the animals in a higher level of comfort. Not only will you feel better about eating the poultry, you can feel good about supporting your community's economy through investing with local producers. All of your protein sources should be available within a one hundred mile radius of your home. This excludes dairy, because there is so much government regulation surrounding the production of dairy and dairy products.
As a purebred cattle owner, I will personally attest that I love what I do. The activities we go through with our cattle are carried out with the utmost respect, the same you apply to your dog or cat. Our animals are most often a significant source of income. They clothe our families, feed our families, and provide income for homes, school, and community purposes. We owe our animals a lot more than you owe your dog or cat or parrot or fish, and we work our hardest to ensure that they are kept happy and healthy. Please believe me when I say that this video is inaccurate in portraying the livestock industry, it disgusts producers to have to see people doing these things to animals. I'll also leave you with one final thought: These camera-men that film this footage. They are right there, watching these horrible acts, and simply filming. Why don't they stand up for the rights of the animals they are watching being beaten or left dying? Why is it they don't report such activities to authorities? Why do they just stand there, and watch these atrocities happen? So that they can take it back to some New York City studio, and edit all the care out of it, all the farmers helping calves nurse, and the chicks under the heating lamps, and the horses being fed and brushed and ridden. They edit out the human side of agriculture, and present you with this monster, rather than acting when they see it and stopping that animal's suffering. That is almost as bad as the acts themselves.
You called it a good video on meat. I hope next time you are human enough to call it a disgusting portrayal of lies and inaccuracies about meat, filmed by people to cowardly to say stop. Thanks, and Gig ‘em.
Hello Cameron - You started out admitting that you can't quite justify why it's ethical to eat meat. It might be easier for you if that question were rephrased to fit the facts: Is it moral to kill innocent life when we don't have to? Maybe that will help you come to your answers.
ReplyDeleteI don't doubt that while your cows are in your care you treat them very well... But I am wondering how you feel when it's financially expedient to send them off to the slaughter? Because then, the only justification is money... The "good care" was only temporary wasn't it? Only when it suited your ends. We know that we only take their lives through force... Because they cannot defend themselves against us. How kind is that? I realize these are tough questions - But I'm sure you can handle them.
As far as the cultural habituation that has allowed us to accept these practices as part of our "food choices" I believe once we never questioned the ethical implications. We really didn't have a choice... But obviously now we have an abundance of them - In fact, more evidence shows us all the time that flesh eating isn't beneficial for health or the environment. Furthermore, we also know a lot about animal sentience... They are beings with personhood, character, desires, quirks and many "human" traits. We can certainly see that they are no different than our beloved pets and we shudder knowing cats and dogs are treated as edible commodities in other countries...
I'm not terribly fond of that video that was suggested to you... May I recommend a few?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xWD1Zze5Qo4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7vWbV9FPo_Q
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-F8whzJfJY&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XhzxuYgHoMs
http://www.nonviolenceunited.org/veganvideo.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GrbYVsK7vs
I think you'll find that it's about the choice to be kind... Surely the world will only benefit if we seek out a new direction with less violence and more thoughtfulness to others. (?) It takes courage to figure out the path to get there - Asking questions is a great start. I'd suggest you not stop those inquiries till you reach the proper conclusions.
Right on, Bea. Obviously I'm a horrible monster who should be behind bars with the terrorists in Cuba. If eating animals is so "wrong," why don't I feel awful after dinner? I should be morally incapacitated after eating a steak, if it is as terrible as you think it is. But, I am not. Clearly a soul-less monster.
ReplyDeleteThe "good care" I provide my animals is certainly not temporary. It's good care, and good care is never temporary. I know what happens in slaughterhouses. The same thing that happens and happened on battlefields the world over. Animals die. Do they die in vain? Certainly not. Humans use animal byproducts in everything. The glue in the plywood in your home? Animal blood was used there. Your clothes? A good chance the dye used on them was created with some animal byproduct. A vain death is a death where the animal is left to rot, and only a trophy is taken. These animals are treated better than most third-world humans, and their bodies are used for the advancement of medicine, construction, and technology.
Animals have human traits? No. Animals have animal traits. Cows behave like cows, not humans. Sheep and chickens behave like sheep and chickens, not humans. I will not dispute that these are intelligent, aware beings with feelings, emotions, and thoughts. But they do not have "Human" traits in the least. If you spent time with cattle, you would understand just how unhuman they really are.
Long and short, I eat the beef I produce. I feel no remorse, I feel no sadness when the steers are loaded on the trailer to go to the slaughterhouse. I don't question myself when I eat meat. At the same time, I am a compassionate, caring person who does not wish ill on anyone. How can these two things exist in the same body? Why do I not feel awful after eating meat? Obviously it's because it isn't wrong to do so.
I have reached my "proper conclusions," and would ask you to try and respect those, just as I will try to respect you and your views. Don't make the mistake of calling me a monster, Ma'am.
Hi Cameron - I don't believe I called you a monster... But I do think your indoctrination has forced your mind to be closed. Here is a reminder of that in your own words: "The question they have posed is a difficult one. One that I have never considered. One that I feel I have the answer to, but have no way of communicating my feelings logically. "Why is it ethical to eat meat?" It's a doozy of a question, that's for sure. The arguments against eating meat based on ethics are incredibly strong, and, I must admit, make certain amounts of logical sense. But there must be some reason why we eat meat. Something way down tells us that the activity is OK, and I have never questioned my moral integrity after tucking in to a beautiful New York or Tenderloin. Why? I don't know."
ReplyDeleteYou ask "If eating animals is so "wrong," why don't I feel awful after dinner?" I take it that you know what moral dissonance is?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-justification
"I know what happens in slaughterhouses. The same thing that happens and happened on battlefields the world over. Animals die."
Animals don't "die" they are killed. Humans have a choice to go to war or not... We can opt for peace - Or a person may leave the country or seek other ways to not fight. Animals don't have that choice. If you're using war as an analogy - They are conscripts. "As long as there are slaughterhouses, there will be battlefields." -Leo Tolstoy
"animal byproducts in everything" - Yes I know. It's quite the challenge to avoid what of those I can. But you'd be surprised how many alternative products there are that don't use flesh, blood or bone. I'm not keen on the idea of using consumables as a disposal ground for body waste. There are other options for everything from lipstick to dyes in clothing. And think of the new markets that are opening up all the time for substitutes! ;)
Animal traits... But of course humans are animals too so perhaps I should have said we share many "animal traits" with them. We have similar reactions to physical pain of course... We both struggle to keep our lives when threatened. Like them, loud noises frighten most of us. We like to feel safe. We can both be bored, hostile, friendly, etc. And as I mentioned, I have spent time with cows... And chickens... And dogs and cats - And really... There's not much of a difference in how each of them responds to fear or kindness at all!
"I don't question myself when I eat meat." Oh but I think you do! But you suppress them as those videos I posted show how we are taught not to think about "meat-eating". If one thinks "too much" they will have to justify their actions or change them. It is very serious business to take life... Without sincere "reason" to validate it - All the "compassion" in the world seems hollow.
You know, there are instances in our history where we engaged in exploitation against women, children and people of other races. At the time I'm sure no one thought it was awful. It was just accepted practice... A slave holder didn't feel bad or abusive. Does that mean that what he was doing was right? I think you're intelligent enough to see where this goes and how your "proper conclusions" don't really mesh with reality at all.
Respectfully, you can't just say "I don't feel bad about it, so it must be right". That sounds like a cop-out for critical thinking... From what you've said thus far - I think you're better than that. Keep questioning - It's the only way to figure it out. ~peace~
I am going to continue to eat the beef I produce. I will continue to relish every bite. I am also going to continue to show the world what it means to be a beef producer, what it means to live on a working farm, and just how good life is out here. Additionally, I will continue to debunk the myths and lies propagated by vegetarian associations about the production of livestock, while trying to remain as respectful as possible. It might get tough, it will be a lifelong fight, but it will continue.
DeleteI am an environmentally responsible, morally sound, kind, smart, funny and educated person. I take care of my livestock, and every year my family and I eat one of the steers we feed, and sell the others. They go to feed families in Calgary, providing safe, tasty, nutrient-rich Alberta beef for their tables. That is the process I am going to University to learn about. I will continue to support the Alberta Beef Producers, The Canadian Beef Breeds Council, the United Farmers of Alberta, the Canadian Cattle Association, 4-H Canada, FFA, The Canadian Limousin Association, The Alberta Limousin Association, and I will read the Alberta Beef Magazine every month for the rest of my life. I will eat meat or poultry every night for dinner, most days for lunch, and some mornings for breakfast, to support the people who also do what I love to do.
As far as I am concerned, I'm a lost cause for you Ma'am. You are, of course, forever welcome on this forum, to discuss every topic under the sun, so long as you remain respectful of my choices, as I remain respectful of yours. Remember that, from where I sit, people like you cost me money every time I sell an animal. I respect your right to choose whether you eat meat or not, but I cannot tolerate you trying to "convert" (pardon the negative connotation that seems to have, but it fits) others under my watch and on my forum. So, as I said, you are welcome, your comments are welcome, as are your thoughts. But, your attitude toward the good people who provide the world with protein needs to be checked at the door.
To leave you with proof that Livestock producers as a whole are not the monsters you believe, here is a quote from "Keeping It Real: Through the Lens of a Farm Girl."
"Nearly one-half of cattle farmers and ranchers volunteer with youth organizations, and more than one-third donate their time to other civic organizations, compared to a national average of seven percent of all Americans." Obviously we are not only farmers and ranchers, but we seem to hold the world together with our general want to do what is right.
Thanks, Gig 'em, and please come back soon. Posts are generally two weeks apart or so.